Interview with Rory Van Grol of Coming Down

Chatting with an old friend and debuting a new song from Coming Down

It’s always a bit difficult to interview your friends, especially those you’ve known for well over 25 years. What do you ask them when you already know all about them? In the case of my old friend Rory Van Grol maybe some of the assumptions I’d had about his time in bands, as a business owner, and his motivations might have been a bit off. After all, we’ve lived on different coasts for over 7 years now so it’s not like we catch up as much as we used to. But in all that time I’ve known him, seeing his bands a million times, touring alongside him, and releasing records for a couple of his bands I’ve never really interviewed him formally. I’m not sure why. I think, more than anything, I’ve just appreciated his friendship and kind nature, and was happy enough to leave it at that (well, let’s add in the sing-alongs with the bands). But with Coming Down, the band he currently fronts, I feel like I made correct assumptions regarding the music and lyrics. The questions I had for Rory focused quite a bit on his current life situation and how that plays into songs from their new record “Curve”. It’s a record of true growth from these Rochester friends who are already quite grown up and have been doing the band for quite a long time. Still, there’s always room for more growth and “Curve” exemplifies that. So, we caught up to talk about Coming Down and that’s a good enough excuse to call up an old friend.

Photo by Spencer Chamberlain

When I was thinking of questions for this- which is hard when you’ve known someone for decades- I don’t why it occurred to me, and maybe I’m totally wrong on this, but I thought maybe in most of your bands you’ve been kind of the backseat guy, even though you’re the frontman. You might not be booking the tours, or fixing the van, or not the public-facing person, or the driving force of your bands. But then I thought, well, maybe he is. Because you have done all those things to a degree. Am I wrong on this, or do you feel as if you’re the back seat guy?

I am when needed. I tend to be very team-oriented. And that’s the way I prefer to work in that sort of environment. As you know, being in bands- especially hardcore-punk bands- it’s personal and you have to let go of your ego and yourself to allow things to work. Whether that comes to songwriting, lyric-writing, or booking shows, or playing with certain bands, or asking bands to play shows.

With Achilles Rob (Antonucci, guitarist) and Chris (Browne, drums) were drivers in that band as far as booking shows and connecting with people. I did that too, but I would kind of softly put it together. I’m a picture-person in that I can throw casts out there, like saying ‘what if we play Richmond?’ and then Chris would say, ‘OK, I know a guy in Richmond’. I can see how to route a tour and I can put puzzle pieces together even if I don’t have all the pieces.

People play to their strengths and you got to work with that. As you know Rob is a great artist and designer, and if you have someone like that in your camp it’s so much easier to do those sorts of things. So let them do it and they’re more psyched on it, and it brings out the best in the band. In Achilles I think that Josh (bassist) is the quiet force. He’s super encouraging and organized, and really thoughtful about the way he influences others, especially when he was so much younger than everyone else in the band. Just how mature that kid was is amazing…. and I say ‘kid’ when he’s not even a kid anymore (laughs).

And in How We Are John (Twentyfive, bassist) was definitely the alpha person. He made the push. He was definitely driven to do things but sometimes you had to pump the brakes and I was the person in the band to do that. Maybe I was able to do it in a way that wasn’t aggravating towards others. I could have some nuance.

It seems that in Coming Down Jon (Garwood, guitarist) is the driving force there. Is that accurate?

Oh yeah, dude…. we would all openly admit that this is his pride and joy. He has a vision and we are supportive of that vision. We love doing the band with him because he always brings stuff to the table where we’re like, ‘where do you come up with these riffs?’ It’s so just…. Jon. It’s also cool having known him since he was a teenager to see him grow into a force of such a good songwriter. It’s really awesome and all organic. But we will still jam stuff out. Phil (Speed, bass) will come up with those bass riffs and it’s a collaborative thing. But Jon will come up with the main part, and the structure of the song. It’s been really cool. Unfortunately it just takes us a really long time to get a finished product. I think it’s just because we really like hanging out as a group. It’s friends first before anything else. We will jam for like 20 minutes and then we’ll just hang out for like an hour.

I think I assumed the original question because it’s a frontperson thing. People see them as front-and-center so the presumption is just that they’re the one running the band and it’s not always the case.

Sure. We all lean on our strengths. I’d say Jon and I guide Coming Down as far as what we are. But Jon is not only musically talented, but he’s artistically talented and has a vision on how to put something together.

In Soul Control you had Jim and Eric, whose a super visual artist and he had that mentality. Stepping into Soul Control was weird because it was me stepping into a band that already existed. That was the first time I’d ever done that. That was a little weird. I always felt a little weird about that until about the end of the band. So I think we wouldn’t have done some of the tours if I hadn’t joined the band, such as bringing Like Wolves on tour with us, or hooking up with Dangers out on the West Coast. Those were things I came up with that we did, but it was more like we wanted to tour with our friends because we just wanted to have fun.

For sure. Still, being the front man and a public-facing part of a band you also have a business and are the face of that business. So I wanted to segue a bit into the lyrics on the new Coming Down. I don’t exactly think this song has to do with being a public-facing person or owning a business, but moreso about the uncertainty that comes with those kinds of responsibilities. In “Naturally” it feels like you’re asking ‘am I good at this? Am I the best person to do what I’m doing?’

Check out the new track “Naturally” from the new Coming Down LP

I think that’s perfectly spot on. The song is also about being conscious about not having the answers or the comfort to be able to do all the right things all the time in that moment. I’ve always felt that I hold myself up to this crazy standard and that I should always because I wouldn’t hold my friends, or my kids, or my wife up to that standard. Because I see what they’re all doing, and the positive aspects of all that, and it’s amazing. It’s great. And I don’t give myself that same buffer. That’s something I’m continually trying to work on, to give myself some grace. I think maybe we all have a piece of ourselves where we do that to ourselves.

I feel like the new album addresses those questions in a few of the songs, a handful of instances where the song is asking, ‘am I doing the right thing?’ And I’m going to go out on a limb here, but I’m pretty sure that question arises in regards to parenting in at least one of the songs.

(laughs) Yeah, I’d say so. But definitely some of it. It’s interesting being a parent as well as an aging punk. You’re in a position, at least I am, where I’ve always talked very openly about being better and putting a better foot forward. And I feel like this batch of songs are some of the first cohesive batch that I’ve written where I’m really like, ‘am I comfortable doing that? Am I allowing myself to do that?’ insofar as it relates to parenting and to work. But also it questions what I’m doing personally. Am I allowing myself space to grow and connect with myself and connect with my loved ones? I often found that I don’t leave space for myself to grow in certain ways. I’m always busy and have projects to do.

It didn’t occur to me until I started looking for some photos to use with this and I found a few of shows I booked for you in 2016 and 2017 that this band has been around for nearly 10 years at this point. I thought how could that be possible, but you all just take really long breaks between releases. And that ties in a bit to your idea about having time for this or that and I get the impression none of you really have a lot of time for bands, which accounts for the long space between releases.

Yeah, that’s crazy. Since we started my second kid was born. Max (Quattrociocci , drums) had two kids. Phil has had two kids. It’s just wild to think that in life I have a 10 year old and a 6 year old. I started this band already being a parent, but having Max and Phil join along in that journey is really cool. We can connect on some of these things in the scheme of doing the right thing of even being a parent, or am I doing the right thing for my kids? It’s a pretty cool conversation and connection to have with those guys. Or the idea of just growing up and being an adult, or going back to school, or switching careers, whatever people are doing. This thing, our band, is our point of connection and our point of being friends and hanging out whether we’re playing shows or not because the thing is practice has been consistent. We’re just not playing that many shows.

photo Spencer Chamberlain

So when you do play shows, and this really has to be a mixed bag, because I see you all as a band that plays with other bands of your age range that are old friends also still doing bands, as well as. bunch of young bands with people half your age. And does that make it tough to connect? I know that when I go to hardcore shows now, or all ages shows, I’m less excited and enthusiastic about what bands are singing about because while that stuff is all important it’s stuff I internalized 20-30 years ago already and I’m past that. I’m more excited for the people there who are just hearing this for the first time because it’s for them, not me. So do you have younger kids just staring at you all wondering why there’s a bunch of dads on stage talking about their kids?

There’s some of that for sure (laughs)! It’s interesting. I went to a show that I wasn’t playing and a mutual friend of ours was there as well and was like, ‘is it OK that we’re still doing this?’ (laughs) And I thought, ‘I would not want to be anywhere else with my free time’. I’m either at home, or at work, or I’m doing this when my kids are asleep. That’s where my friends are, that’s where my connection is, ya know? So it’s really neat to be allowed into those spaces still after nearly 30 years of playing in bands, which is crazy to me. But as far as wondering if people like Coming Down, or connecting with people, I’ve always been in left-of-center bands that don’t necessarily connect with people. I mean, I’ve been in bands that people connect strongly to, sure. But I’m also used to people not getting it, for lack of a better term. I’ve come across a lot of people who would see one of my bands and think, ‘oh, that’s a weird riff’, or ‘I can’t mosh to that’. So I’m comfortable with it if people don’t get it. because at this point it’s about the connection we have playing together and the fun we have hanging out together. That means so much more to me. But I do see a lot of youthful energy, which is amazing. Because it’s for the kids. When we were younger we were the ones moshing and singing along, right? And now it takes way more energy and excitement for us to do that. And the driver behind that is kids just wanting to jump around and do whatever. It can be freeing as an adult to be in those rooms and realizing that energy still exists. I still see kids talking about these things that are so important, and are still important to us. Like being vegan and being straightedge is important to us but it’s not our identity, but they’re a core value. There’s that foundational block that we built everything else up on.

So it’s not that I see many vegan straightedge bands out there, it’s just an example. Now you see a lot of bands talking about anti-racism and transphobia, trans lives, and stuff and it’s all a super important message. I see so much more diversity, at least in Rochester, of people coming out to shows, looking however they want to and in a freeing way. There’s less stigmatism about looking fashionable than there ever was when I started going to shows.

It’s a similar thing here as well- very diverse crowds and tons of energy. But there’s also this weird thing where you see kids at shows who are probably like 14 or 15 and they all look like they were in a Korn video or something. That style was kind of silly when it started and 30 years later it still looks silly. But who am I to judge?

Do you remember that trend for a bit when hardcore kids were wearing visors? Like rave-style visors?

(laughs) Yes, that was awful. We had our own way of expressing regrettable fashion choices.

And people are wearing JNCOs again? I’m sorry, but I’m not going back to that.

No, definitely not. I see kids wearing those and I think to myself, ‘I’ll let you make that mistake and you’ll eventually figure it out.’ Those things are not practical in any way whatsoever.

But ya know, the pendulum swings. Super tight jeans were also not a great look.

It’s true. When you look at pictures or video from things like Hellfest 2001 or whatever it’s pretty bad. The fashion you saw at that time was pretty terrible, I don’t know why it got big. But you’re right, the pendulum swings, yet the energy remains and that’s rad.

And it’s cool to see people and younger bands talking about things. And there’s still rooms to do that in, which I think is super important. And I think it’s important for younger people to see people like us still around. It wasn’t as generational when I was coming up. There were some older heads, but not as much as it is now. I see shows where there’s a bunch of parents and a bunch of kids, and some parents with their kids! I think that’s great.

That’s another odd phenomenon- when we were teenagers getting into punk how much history did we have to fall back on? 10 or 15 years? That seems like a long time, but in the grand scope that’s not much. And it was harder to find roots stuff even if someone told you to seek out, for example, the ’82 scene of San Diego. Like, how am I going to find that in 1994 when there’s no internet and I live in New York?

But once in awhile when I do find myself talking to someone way younger than me and I’ll start to bring up old bands and then I have to stop myself because they probably have no idea who I’m talking about because it was some obscure band from 25 years ago. And yet, often they will know who I’m talking about because they can instantly look it up in five seconds.

So I find the conversation now is easier despite age because hardcore history is all so accessible now and we didn’t necessarily have that most of the time. It used to be odd to see someone at a show who was over the age of 30, definitely way more uncommon. Not so uncommon now. Just don’t be the weird old guy at the show, ya know?

Coming Down, Westcott Community Center, Syracuse, 2017

(laughs) Well, it’s OK to be a weirdo at a show when you’re young, and it’s OK to be weird when you’re older and have kids, and other responsibilities. It’s not just for the comic book dorks anymore.

Switching it up, and this may be a super dated question at this point, but there’s a lot of times that I’ll think of a place and I associate a person with that place, like they’re a defining part of that place for me. And when I think of Rochester I associate you with that place since you’ve done a lot there and have been there a long time. But unlike people I think of as lifers for a place you actually lived away from Rochester for awhile. I wanted to get your perspective on going away and then coming back, even though you’ve been back for over 10 years at this point.

It was cool. I will say that I was one of those folks who never needed to move away. I never thought, ‘I hate Rochester, I need to get out of this place’. I was offered an opportunity with my friend Brian Van Etten. He asked me to move to Providence with him. At the time I was actually looking into buying a house and settling down. This was around 2007. But then I thought, ‘you know what, I should do something else and experience somewhere else that isn’t just getting in a van and touring.’ So How We Are was breaking up and people were moving on from that. Achilles was winding down because Chris was going to law school in Boston. I didn’t really have anything holding me back. I didn’t have a significant other at the time. I just had work. So when my lease was up I just went and did it. I gave myself a year timeline, no plans to do music out there, nothing. So Brian found a spot, I moved in with him, sight unseen, and then he left after just about a year when he finished culinary school, and I stuck around for almost three years. It seems longer.

It really does. It felt like you were gone a long time.

I moved back to Rochester in 2010. I’m typically really bad with dates but I know this one because the Owl House (Rochester restaurant) opened that same year and I helped open that place. That’s not the reason I moved back, but I started working there.

But Providence was really cool. I met a lot of awesome people there, I joined Soul Control randomly, was able to make some life long lasting connections there, and it was kind of like Rochester in a lot of ways. And somehow people there were nice to me, which is not always a common thing when you’re from out of town.

Still from “You Feel Okay"?” video by Mike Turzanski

But the perspective is that I came back and I realized I rode my bike way more when I was in Providence. Things aren’t as far away as people seem to think they are. Rochester is a very car-centric city and that was a huge thing that I noticed. Public transportation infrastructure here is terrible, biking infrastructure is terrible. So when I moved back I didn’t have a vehicle. I was always the band van guy in bands. Since I never had an instrument I took on the responsibility of having the van. But then our van died so it stayed in Rhode Island. I moved back and Ben from Like Wolves actually drove down with his van and I loaded everything in his van in one trip and went back to Rochester.

I found out right away that I didn’t have a ton of easy access to the things I was used to having in Providence, like a good coffee shop, or a record store within walking distance because it’s a more dense city. That was frustrating. But at the same time the folks in this region are just so much nicer. People want to engage with you in a way that they don’t want to in New England. Specifically, you can say ‘hi’ to someone random person and they will say ‘hi’ back or give a friendly nod. My wife laughs at me because our kids already have some of those mannerisms. I would go on walks with them a lot and just say ‘hi’ to people in the neighborhood and our kids would do that too. They get it from me I guess!

It’s modeling behavior.

Yeah, I guess!

But you’ve also toured more than most people I know between several different bands. And you’re in a band now…. well actually, several bands, that don’t tour at all and play out less frequently. Is it an odd place to be in, to slow down like that and not be in a different city every night, or completely physically exhausting yourself on stage each night? Plus, not doing those things every night sort of makes it harder to do them when you do play infrequently.

One hundred percent. Going from touring, like doing a seven week tour with no days off, gives me such an adverse reaction. I don’t even want to think about doing that again! I couldn’t physically do it. When I met my wife I was probably in the best physical shape of my life and that was because of touring with Soul Control. We were always on the road. I had already moved back to Rochester but we were still touring a lot.

I’m a very physical person when I’m playing, but I can’t be that intense because my body will no longer allow me to be! I’m not as flexible. I have broken bones and pulled muscles and I’ve done things in my youth that are now catching up to me so I can’t do everything that I used to.

But I am trying to take care of myself by riding bikes and doing a bit of working out. But I’m not as fit as I once was, being a 44 year old dad of two kids. I would say that parenting is much along the lines of doing an overnight drive and having to punch into work as soon as you get back.

So it’s like you are touring, just touring in place!

(laughs) Yeah, and still eating all the leftovers.

Still eating like garbage! Just like a real touring band. Nothing’s changed! But aside from those things, like parenting, and everyone being busy with stuff, it does feel like your new record “Curve” has been brewing for a long time. I think I recall talking to guys about it maybe three years ago. What do you think sidelined the activity for awhile?

Honestly, there was a lot of insecurity about how we felt about the songs. You ever feel like you get stuck on just one part of a song? And then the people who wrote it get sick of it and just throw it away. That happened a bunch with us. Some of these songs we’ve had now for almost seven years and we had to go through this cycle of thinking they were done, and then re-evaluating them and they didn’t feel done, and then setting them aside. Then someone would say, ‘what about that one song we had’ and it will come back into the cycle.

There was also some letting go. Let’s just try it, let’s roll with it. It can be finished in that moment. We can finish these things, we can do these things. And I think a part of it too is just giving ourselves a timeline because we got caught up in not finishing stuff. We would get ready to play a show and come up with a set list and since it would be so infrequent that we would play a show we would do that instead of practicing these new songs. And then kids happened intermittently in-between there and that took time away because people had to do parenting. So I think there were a few factors for how long it took to do this record. But ultimately, we didn’t want to rush things and didn’t realize how long it had been taking to complete things. We had to step up and finish this and get it done. We just booked the time to finish the songs and then went and recorded it. Even recording took over a year to finish because of us. We kept tinkering with things and I was doing different things vocally that were taking me a long time. This is the first time I ever demo’ed vocals on a record.

Me and Jon would get together and demo vocals, which I’ve never done. I’ve always just gone into a room, put things out there, and hope for the best.

But these songs are just so different than anything I’ve been a part of, vocally. And I didn’t want to do the same old, same old. So I just pushed myself and listened to Jon and some of the melodies he was making up and asked myself, ‘can I do that?’ It was really hard for me to be honest. I was very nervous. There were a couple times where I thought, ‘did you guys write these songs with me in mind to be in this band?’ Legitimately I was like, ‘I don’t know if I can do this’. Jon was very helpful though. He believed in me and said, ‘I know you can do this and it’s going to be awesome. We’ll figure this out’

I am super excited to share these songs with people. We went through a lot individually and together as a group. We lost some really special people around our band, we lost people in our own lives, but we’ve also added to our families. So it was pretty intense for all of us.

Hard to condense that down into a handful of songs. There’s a lot of lived experience there.

There’s always room for more songs.

“Curve” comes out on March 21st via Hex Records.